We need Change!!

[Copper Collar]

Originally Posted by NoBones

With that being said lets try to pass on that safety equipment is not
just there to be there.. It may someday save your life or someone elses!

Very true and you should take the time to know how, when, and why to use that equipment to maximize your chance of rescue.

[gofastsandman]

Originally Posted by NoBones

I must confess..

At the time I started this thread was totally caught up in the hype
of these two young boys missing at sea that obviously perished in the same!

I to do not like the government mandating ANYTHING on my freedom..

Hence, after alot of soul searching, realize the responability falls on the end user.....

I have always tried to keep everything life saving on all my boats
up to date. God forbid the need ever arises.

Education is the answer. Lil' Kenny passed the Coast Guard exam at
age 10, my daughter at age 12..
They both enjoy the water as much if not more then I do...
Both of them are in their 30's

I took this mishap close to heart, as I did the same thing in Florida at the
tender age of 14, so did Lil'Kenny (but he got busted by a friend
that saw him and called me)

With that being said lets try to pass on that safety equipment is not
just there to be there.. It may someday save your life or someone elses!

Respectfully, and humbly submitted

Most of us pushed the limits of youth. I`m still pushing it. I finally came to the conclusion
that I am not going to West End until I rewire the boat. I just don't trust it and understand
the consequences. Forty years ago this might have been my SAR.

We all had an emotional attachment of youth and the mutual bond of the hull tugging on our heart strings. What smart young kid would not want a SC? Most of us have had an offshore
Oh S moment or two or more...

In the end, this did not have to end as it seemingly has and to that end I am with the mandate.

I also do not like DC and all they do not stand for which is freedom. My knee jerk reaction is the same. This did not have to happen. I chose to buy a plb after the football players went
missing. My choice.

Could a mandate save millions on SAR? Yep. Could it save lives? Yep,
Is it worth giving up more of our freedom? I`m still conflicted.
Hopefully my plb will keep me from being the cause of a greatly reduced GDP on CSC.

Live Free Or Die???

Never thought I would question that.

[Fr. Frank]

Our government was initially designed to provide the maximum freedom to each individual, by means of requiring maximum responsibility from each individual.
This means that each person is accountable for their actions and decisions, and the consequences appertaining thereto.

HOWEVER, we all also have the freedom to help others, AND the moral responsibility to do so if we are able, as long as such actions do not bring greater danger to others.

As a trained EMT, and current Civil Air Patrol SAR pilot, as well as being a CAP chaplain and a parish priest, I understand fully the desire to enact something that might help prevent the great emotional angst when a tragedy like this one takes place. I volunteer as I do because I feel this as keenly as anyone who is not immediately affected can.

Governmental regulation is not the answer. Training and volunteer response is the answer. People helping their neighbor is the answer.

The continual erosion of personal responsibility by abdication of the same to corporate or communal governmental authority is, in fact, the source of some of the problems. We have become Diversionist Moral Awfulizers. We run around in circles and cry out, "Someone Must Do Something!", instead of resolving firmly, "I Must Do Something".

And we wonder, at times, why Nobody did anything. Sometimes I ask people who are caught up and frozen in high emotional response to tragedy, "What have you personally done to either help this situation or what will you be doing to help prevent similar tragedies, that doesn't trample on a person's right to exercise free will?"
(I get mostly blank looks at this question, or a "Who, me?" response).

"Everybody knows that Somebody should do all the important things that Anybody could do: All the good things that Nobody did".

[kmoose]

Originally Posted by Fr. Frank

Our government was initially designed to provide the maximum freedom to each individual, by means of requiring maximum responsibility from each individual.
This means that each person is accountable for their actions and decisions, and the consequences appertaining thereto.

HOWEVER, we all also have the freedom to help others, AND the moral responsibility to do so if we are able, as long as such actions do not bring greater danger to others.

As a trained EMT, and current Civil Air Patrol SAR pilot, as well as being a CAP chaplain and a parish priest, I understand fully the desire to enact something that might help prevent the great emotional angst when a tragedy like this one takes place. I volunteer as I do because I feel this as keenly as anyone who is not immediately affected can.

Governmental regulation is not the answer. Training and volunteer response is the answer. People helping their neighbor is the answer.

The continual erosion of personal responsibility by abdication of the same to corporate or communal governmental authority is, in fact, the source of some of the problems. We have become Diversionist Moral Awfulizers. We run around in circles and cry out, "Someone Must Do Something!", instead of resolving firmly, "I Must Do Something".

And we wonder, at times, why Nobody did anything. Sometimes I ask people who are caught up and frozen in high emotional response to tragedy, "What have you personally done to either help this situation or what will you be doing to help prevent similar tragedies, that doesn't trample on a person's right to exercise free will?"
(I get mostly blank looks at this question, or a "Who, me?" response).

"Everybody knows that Somebody should do all the important things that Anybody could do: All the good things that Nobody did".

OK, I totally agree with your views on personal responsibility, the lack there of and need for us all to pursue actions to help others develop such. My question to you is as an active SARs specialist, should PLBs/EPIRBs be added to the already enforced and established list of required safety gear to vessels traversing offshore?

[Terry England]

Yea, I got ya', and you are all right about various and sundry topics.
However, I know a couple of different people who sunk their boats. They said everything happens really fast and you are in the water in seconds. A couple of 'em spent the night tread'in water hanging on to an Igloo, waiting to be gathered up by somebody. One of 'em was a 23 Seacraft trying to roll over a Sea Ray that had sunk and "turtled"! I know some that passed the football players heading out Clearwater Pass at daybreak. They were coming in because it was just too raggedy. They were thinking "Where the heck are they (the football players) going in this S*%#?"

The deal is ain't none of you guys married to Marsha! She'd run up one side of me and down the other like a chain saw if she had something brush up on her leg a 2:30 in the morn'in that felt like sandpaper, if we were treading water - waiting to get gathered up. You see, I'd been afraid of dying up to that point - then I'd been afraid of liv'ing! As quick as the helicopter set down at Clearwater Air Station she'd start in and she'd still be going on about that at my funeral 10 years later!

Like Roy Orbison once said "I got a women mean as she can be be - sometimes she's almost mean as me" (that's a pretty good tune)

For less than 100 gallons of gas, I know someone will be pointed toward us relatively shortly. It might be Mel, and she'll have those great sandwches packed - if Kenny was on board he'd give me he!! from now on. Like furgett'in my flippers!

[Tarpun]

Sounds like mandatory motorcycle helmets. They might have found those boys if they had been wearing life jackets. Maybe the government should make that mandated.

[wattaway2]

Motor cycle helmets---Exwife is a trama nurse she hated when they changed the Fl. law to no helmets and they would come in with mush for brains. Funny how you cant drive a car without seatbelts but its ok to ride a bike without a helmet of any type. Raced cars and rode bikes --ALWAYS had a helmet on

[kmoose]

Originally Posted by wattaway2

Motor cycle helmets---Exwife is a trama nurse she hated when they changed the Fl. law to no helmets and they would come in with mush for brains. Funny how you cant drive a car without seatbelts but its ok to ride a bike without a helmet of any type. Raced cars and rode bikes --ALWAYS had a helmet on

And just think about how treating people who make poor choices on safety effect our overall insurance rates and health costs. Insurance companies should wave claims for those who choose to ride "free" of such cumbersome and intrusive government safety mandates.

[Fr. Frank]

Originally Posted by kmoose

OK, I totally agree with your views on personal responsibility, the lack there of and need for us all to pursue actions to help others develop such. My question to you is as an active SARs specialist, should PLBs/EPIRBs be added to the already enforced and established list of required safety gear to vessels traversing offshore?

Actually, I think PLB's should be required for every life jacket.
The pure cost of the PLB to manufacture is only about $16-17 each. Since the batteries already have a mandated shelf life, and are Lithium batteries, that's where the expense is: about $40-$65 each. Monitoring is accomplished via an already established network of satellites, so no additional cost for that.